[yunir]

Ethnocentricism is an egoistic manner in which one views the world. One's world view is believed to be supreme over all other world view which is necessarily faulty. An ethnocentric person will judge other people based on one's own values and norms.

It's something like: I like the color Purple and I hate Orange. So, as an ethnocentric person, when I see someone wearing an orange colored shirt, I'd say that guy is stupid and has no taste. I judge that person simply by my own preferences and my own set of ideals.

Are realists ethnocentric?

[yunir]

No I don't. Did I imply that?
If I was, then I'm automatically an ethnocentric

What I'm saying is, if realists were ethnocentrics, it would defeat the very founding idea of realists it self. - seeking what is real.

By being ethnocentric, one automatically rules out all other possibilities. Instead of looking at every possible choices, an ethnocentrics would prefer to believe in ideas and values that is already pre-established and fixed in the head, ready to reject any new/incoming suggestions, without a second thought.

[dil]

yunir, on Nov 24 2006, 12:39 PM, said:

No I don't. Did I imply that?
If I was, then I'm automatically an ethnocentric

What I'm saying is, if realists were ethnocentrics, it would defeat the very founding idea of realists it self. - seeking what is real.

By being ethnocentric, one automatically rules out all other possibilities. Instead of looking at every possible choices, an ethnocentrics would prefer to believe in ideas and values that is already pre-established and fixed in the head, ready to reject any new/incoming suggestions, without a second thought.

with that definition of ethnocentric, you could use it interchangeably with the word close-minded

it's not the same.

ethnocentricity is the belief that one race is superior to another.

[yunir]

dil, on Nov 25 2006, 05:15 AM, said:

ethnocentricity is the belief that one race is superior to another.

Race is another instresting issue that can be discussed in another thread.

Ethnocentricism is not about race - that would be racism.
It is about believing the superiority of one's values over another.

And like I said, If realists were truly ethnocentrics, then it would defeat the fundamental idea of realists itself.
I therefore, suggest, realists cannot and should not be ethnocentrics.

[dil]

Quote

eth‧no‧cen‧trism  /ˌɛθnoʊˈsɛntrɪzəm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[eth-noh-sen-triz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation

–noun 1. Sociology. the belief in the inherent superiority of one's own ethnic group or culture.
2. a tendency to view alien groups or cultures from the perspective of one's own.

you've got the wrong idea of what ethnocentric is.

realists are not remotely ethnocentric.

[yunir]

dil, on Nov 25 2006, 05:32 AM, said:

you've got the wrong idea of what ethnocentric is.

culture and groups does not equal race. Sorry, I major in Sociology.

ahhh then, good to know that realists are not ethnocentrics. Therefore, they should not be advocating people who believe in mystical things are stupid right?

[dil]

yunir, on Nov 24 2006, 01:36 PM, said:

culture and groups does not equal race. Sorry, I major in Sociology.

ahhh then, good to know that realists are not ethnocentrics. Therefore, they should not be advocating people who believe in mystical things are stupid right?

Quote

eth·nic (thnk) Pronunciation Key
adj.

Of or relating to a sizable group of people sharing a common and distinctive racial, national, religious, linguistic, or cultural heritage.

ethno-centric (look at the roots of the word itself)

ethnic groups, can be racial.

In such a context, the spanish, who invaded south america thought they were 'superior peoples' to the natives that lived there. They were ethnocentric, they justified what horrible things they did by thinking themselves worthier or 'superior' to others. We don't justify our beliefs by suggesting we're better than people, we justify our beliefs by reason. And being ethnocentric is not remotely reasonable (thinking yourself better because you're white or spanish or english or whatever).

As realists, we don't think we are the 'chosen' people, and we don't think we're better 'racially, or culturally'. But if you're going to say realists are ethnocentric because they believe themselve to be 'going about life' in the correct manner, then everyone, by that watered down shitty definition would be ethnocentric, including yourself.

On a lighter note:

Quote

"Happiness resides not in possessions and not in gold. The feeling of happiness dwells in the soul."
- Democritus

hmm, I have no soul. Don't believe in one, does that mean I'm unhappy

[yunir]

Ok, fine..... I'll play by that definition.
I'm not saying realists are ethnocentric. I do not know. That is why I asked.

So, let me drop the term ethnocentric and rephrase the question to:
Do realists think people are stupid because they pray to something realists don't believe in?

Quote

hmm, I have no soul. Don't believe in one, does that mean I'm unhappy

hehehe.... i don't know about that. You can wake the guy up and ask him.

[Plutodog]

yunir, on Nov 24 2006, 10:25 PM, said:

So, let me drop the term ethnocentric and rephrase the question to:
Do realists think people are stupid because they pray to something realists don't believe in?

I get the feeling you're trying to manipulate us into a corner, Yunir, and that's a waste of your time and ours. So the following is probably wasted but what the hay I have a little time.

First, realists "believe in" what is demonstrably, see feel touch REAL. We don't know what all's real but we've seen a whole lotta bullshit, had it up to here with a lotta crap that's been foisted on us as real, as true, and said you must believe or you will go to hell or some other imaginary and ghastly place to suffer. We're going to be more than happy to "believe in" god when he steps on up in public and in person and introduces himself (or herself).

Actually, "believe in" is an inaccurate way to put it. It means basically to take some very critical "fact" on faith, which we aint a gonna. Been there, done that, you're wasting your time thinking you can drag us back into that morass. Go proseletize elsewhere.

Second, whether you're stupid or scared or brainwashed or childish or magically gifted with a belief in a god doesn't matter. It doesn't work for us. If it will make you cut the crap then fine, no you're not stupid to believe in god but you are irritating and come off as supercilious to find yourself wonderfully occupied by seeking converts here so please cut the crap or else go away voluntarily.

Arf Arf

[Queen Qaab]

yunir, you ask: "Do realists think people are stupid because they pray to something realists don't believe in?"


Some realists do think that. I don't. I generally think goddists have not intellectually evolved toward reality in the way that realists and atheists have.

It's actually okay by me, so long as they don't shove their religion down my throat in my own church.

[yunir]

Plutodog, on Nov 25 2006, 03:05 PM, said:

Second, whether you're stupid or scared or brainwashed or childish or magically gifted with a belief in a god doesn't matter. It doesn't work for us. If it will make you cut the crap then fine, no you're not stupid to believe in god...........

Quote

Some realists do think that. I don't. I generally think goddists have not intellectually evolved toward reality in the way that realists and atheists have.

Alright... that's all I wanted to know. You have answered my question. Thank you!

I am not seeking to convert anyone, not through a forum. Please!

I am here in the interest of realist itself. I give ideas for people to think about, and I let others present me with ideas to think about. I think the founders of this COR called it exploration? And also, seeking what is real by scrutinizing. Isn't that found in the main website somewhere?

anyway, thx again Plutodog and QQ!

[dil]

Queen Qaab, on Nov 24 2006, 11:55 PM, said:

yunir, you ask: "Do realists think people are stupid because they pray to something realists don't believe in?"
Some realists do think that. I don't. I generally think goddists have not intellectually evolved toward reality in the way that realists and atheists have.

It's actually okay by me, so long as they don't shove their religion down my throat in my own church.

Smart people can have some pretty stupid beliefs.

I admit I do sneer down upon some creationist's beliefs and some theistic beliefs. But I don't discriminate on the basis of religion. I discriminate on the basis of behaviour, oh wait, that isn't discrimination at all

[yunir]

programming.... interesting idea quist.
so, you mean, it is innately human to do prayers?
Now, after millions of evolution, why is it still an innate behaviour?
We can argue that prayers exists beacuse people are always preaching and all.

But I think wishing upon a star, having good luck charms and other non-deity superstition should also be considered praying.

When we are stranded on an unknown island, or in the mddle of the ocean, we hope for our survival. But what are these hopes based on? I think to hope is also a form of prayer.

hmmm... talking about getting stranded, I think my compass is broken. I'm drifting away from the topic.

[yunir]

I think it is innate for humans to perform prayers deity-based or otherwise. But overtime, some people overcome this innate behaviour through rationalization.

you posed the question "If a child was born with no concept of prayer, would he or she ever feel the inclination to pray?"

I would think yes. But how the prayer is done and to who or what would probably be entirely up to the child's own worldview. It's just my thoughts anyway.

I think this is one scientific question that will probably remain unanswered. We can seclude a child from the world and see how that child behaves, but that would be inhumane.

Hmm maybe we can use clones??