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Do People Want to Change?
I know that we, myself included, have talked incessantly about making change, but we have never asked the question if most people want change.
Personally, I do not see it. If people really wanted to change, they would. There is no one great power, alien or other, that seems to have control over ourselves and the planet. So why don't most people make positive changes for themselves and their environment?
Before any of us start to blame concepts like religion or government for the lack of positive change, remember that governments, society, religions, nations and so on are made up of individuals. Many individuals develop or believe in irrational, illogical or false concepts and it is these individuals who need to change. It is only individuals that truly can make change, not concepts.
There seems to be so few people who are aware, rational, logical, empathetic and intelligent enough to offer or accept positive change. Many of the members here at the RDL have come up with great ideas, but how do a few change the minds of the many, especially when the many do not desire change?
Any thoughts?
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Do People Want to Change?
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#2
RareBear 
- Group: Members
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- Joined: 05-July 06
Posted 06 January 2007 - 12:05 AM
By and large, people ALWAYS want positive change. But what most pursue is change for themselves to improve their quality of life. There is very little in the way of cooperation for social and political goals--either in education or life (at least here in winner-takes-all America). The internet is the relatively new phenomenon that is prompting many people to explore parts of their sociology that they never had the chance to do before. But even designers of internet modalities and content are limited by their competitive rather than cooperative heritage. We can either die as spectators or we can seize the moment and try to make what we have all it can be. I work to envision what would really matter and spend all of my time thinking and writing about it. Whether or not I can get anyone else to ever cooperate with me to "git 'r done" is another story.
#3
- Group: Guests
Posted 06 January 2007 - 12:27 AM
Here are some of the reasons that I have observed why people do not make positive change.
1. Fear : The biggest reason that people do not make positive change in their lives is fear. Fear of the unkown, fear of persecution, fear of alienation and so on.
2. Comfort : People who become very comfortable with their life and do not want to change, even if it is positive. Also known as indifference, laziness or apathy.
3. Programming : People who have been educated or coersed to "believe" that their negative belief systems are correct and do not need to be changed. Also known as delusion or brainwashed.
4. Ego : People who believe that they are beyond the need for any change.
BTW, RearBear I generally agree with your sentiment from your last post.
1. Fear : The biggest reason that people do not make positive change in their lives is fear. Fear of the unkown, fear of persecution, fear of alienation and so on.
2. Comfort : People who become very comfortable with their life and do not want to change, even if it is positive. Also known as indifference, laziness or apathy.
3. Programming : People who have been educated or coersed to "believe" that their negative belief systems are correct and do not need to be changed. Also known as delusion or brainwashed.
4. Ego : People who believe that they are beyond the need for any change.
BTW, RearBear I generally agree with your sentiment from your last post.
#4
RareBear
- Group: Members
- Posts: 543
- Joined: 05-July 06
Posted 06 January 2007 - 01:57 AM
quist, on Jan 5 2007, 07:27 PM, said:
Here are some of the reasons that I have observed why people do not make positive change.
1. Fear : The biggest reason that people do not make positive change in their lives is fear. Fear of the unkown, fear of persecution, fear of alienation and so on.
2. Comfort : People who become very comfortable with their life and do not want to change, even if it is positive. Also known as indifference, laziness or apathy.
3. Programming : People who have been educated or coersed to "believe" that their negative belief systems are correct and do not need to be changed. Also known as delusion or brainwashed.
4. Ego : People who believe that they are beyond the need for any change.
BTW, RearBear I generally agree with your sentiment from your last post.
1. Fear : The biggest reason that people do not make positive change in their lives is fear. Fear of the unkown, fear of persecution, fear of alienation and so on.
2. Comfort : People who become very comfortable with their life and do not want to change, even if it is positive. Also known as indifference, laziness or apathy.
3. Programming : People who have been educated or coersed to "believe" that their negative belief systems are correct and do not need to be changed. Also known as delusion or brainwashed.
4. Ego : People who believe that they are beyond the need for any change.
BTW, RearBear I generally agree with your sentiment from your last post.
You forgot lust.
#6
- Group: Guests
Posted 17 May 2007 - 06:55 PM
Yay for Frankenstein (I am making a habit of this 
) another good dead topic risen from the grave. MUHAHAHA!!
Do people want to change???
There are two sides to this coin as I see it.
The first side is do people want things to change and the awnser to that is a resounding yes. People always want things to be better than they are. No matter how good we ever have it we will always want it to be better. America is a fine example of this, we live far more comfortable lives than the majority of the people in the world and what do we do. claim that gas prices are to high claim that the economy is to bad and want for a thousand other things.
The other side of the coin is people's willingness to change themselves. This is the clincher. This is where it gets really tough because dispite how good it could be people are very rarely willing to change themselves. take for example the frog in water comparison, a frog will jump out of a pot of boiling water but if the water starts at room temp and is brought to a boil what do you have??? cooked frog.
people are much the same as this. it takes a sudden shock for people to even realize that there really is a problem. you can also look at it from a marketing perspective. There are about 2% of the population who are innovators. These people will try new things go new places and then they will tell their friends about it. These are the people who are willing to change with the times and there is only about 2% of them in the populous. the rest of the people in the world are adopters, these are the people who will try these new things only when suggested to them by someone they trust. they represent about 73% of the populous. Lastly there are late adopters, who will not change untill the idea has become commonspread and in wide popularity, these represent about 20% of the populous. finally the last 5% will never ever try it no matter what you say or do, these are the non-participants.
This is the model to which people adapt to new ideas and products and it actually is pretty acurate (take any marketing and you will start to understand). Now imagine that you are trying to sell them on an idea that while it will save them in the long run does nothing now and all you get are frogs in a bowl of water.......
...... so what do you think the temp is up to at this point????
) another good dead topic risen from the grave. MUHAHAHA!!Do people want to change???
There are two sides to this coin as I see it.
The first side is do people want things to change and the awnser to that is a resounding yes. People always want things to be better than they are. No matter how good we ever have it we will always want it to be better. America is a fine example of this, we live far more comfortable lives than the majority of the people in the world and what do we do. claim that gas prices are to high claim that the economy is to bad and want for a thousand other things.
The other side of the coin is people's willingness to change themselves. This is the clincher. This is where it gets really tough because dispite how good it could be people are very rarely willing to change themselves. take for example the frog in water comparison, a frog will jump out of a pot of boiling water but if the water starts at room temp and is brought to a boil what do you have??? cooked frog.
people are much the same as this. it takes a sudden shock for people to even realize that there really is a problem. you can also look at it from a marketing perspective. There are about 2% of the population who are innovators. These people will try new things go new places and then they will tell their friends about it. These are the people who are willing to change with the times and there is only about 2% of them in the populous. the rest of the people in the world are adopters, these are the people who will try these new things only when suggested to them by someone they trust. they represent about 73% of the populous. Lastly there are late adopters, who will not change untill the idea has become commonspread and in wide popularity, these represent about 20% of the populous. finally the last 5% will never ever try it no matter what you say or do, these are the non-participants.
This is the model to which people adapt to new ideas and products and it actually is pretty acurate (take any marketing and you will start to understand). Now imagine that you are trying to sell them on an idea that while it will save them in the long run does nothing now and all you get are frogs in a bowl of water.......
...... so what do you think the temp is up to at this point????
#7
Partile
- Group: Members
- Posts: 5
- Joined: 22-October 09
Posted 22 October 2009 - 05:48 AM
I have found some interesting thoughts posted in this topic about why people do not want to change but the strongest aversion to change was not among them.
Yes there is programming to destroy before change is possible, and yes, fear of the unknown is a deterrent, but the strongest deterrent is the energy friends and family with throw at you if you decide to make changes in your life. You will receive unspoken anger and invalidation that you may not be conscious of, but as spirit you are going to have to be certain of your beliefs to withstand the onslaught.
The reality of losing friendships and being invalidated by family is more painful than anything that change, itself, would create. Our body does like comfort and yet comfort is rather boring. Comfort will always lose out to the desire for change, but the threat of losing relationships with loved ones is very powerful. Which raises the question... why do our loved ones invalidate us when we strive for change?
The answers are pretty much the same... they are comfortable with the way you are. They fear the changes you will bring about. But mostly, they are not prepared to make those changes themselves and if they can't have it... then you can't have it. They will psychically fight you tooth and nail.
Who will now be so naive to think that choosing to make change in their life only effect them? And none of what I've said is reason enough to not make changes.
Yes there is programming to destroy before change is possible, and yes, fear of the unknown is a deterrent, but the strongest deterrent is the energy friends and family with throw at you if you decide to make changes in your life. You will receive unspoken anger and invalidation that you may not be conscious of, but as spirit you are going to have to be certain of your beliefs to withstand the onslaught.
The reality of losing friendships and being invalidated by family is more painful than anything that change, itself, would create. Our body does like comfort and yet comfort is rather boring. Comfort will always lose out to the desire for change, but the threat of losing relationships with loved ones is very powerful. Which raises the question... why do our loved ones invalidate us when we strive for change?
The answers are pretty much the same... they are comfortable with the way you are. They fear the changes you will bring about. But mostly, they are not prepared to make those changes themselves and if they can't have it... then you can't have it. They will psychically fight you tooth and nail.
Who will now be so naive to think that choosing to make change in their life only effect them? And none of what I've said is reason enough to not make changes.
#8
Ocelot
- Group: Members
- Posts: 1,128
- Joined: 22-May 06
Posted 22 October 2009 - 08:58 AM
Sounds like your speaking from a personal standpoint. Is this hostility from family and friends that you've actually experienced after coming out as an atheist or is it hostility that you anticipate and fear that prevents you from being yourself?
Good buy and gobble less.
Ocelot.
A myth is a fixed way of looking at the world which cannot be destroyed because, looked at through the myth, all evidence supports the myth.
-Edward De Bono, consultant, writer, and speaker (1933- )
Ocelot.
A myth is a fixed way of looking at the world which cannot be destroyed because, looked at through the myth, all evidence supports the myth.
-Edward De Bono, consultant, writer, and speaker (1933- )
#9
Poor Richard
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- Joined: 16-April 09
- Gender:Male
- Location:Huntsville, AL
- Interests:Science, philosophy, evolutionary psychology, cognitive neuroscience, cosmology, Gurdjieff, intentional community
Posted 23 October 2009 - 06:37 PM
Partile,
Peer pressure and family pressure are like religion, they all spring from the herd instinct and the law of the herd which is authoritarian and conformist.
That authoritarian pressure is the enemy of free thought and the quest for knowledge. The pain of becoming an outsider comes with the territory. It is a badge of honor and courage.
You will have opportunities to find new friends and partners that affirm your changes.
I'm glad you found the CoR and this forum. You sound like someone with a lot to contribute.
Richard
Peer pressure and family pressure are like religion, they all spring from the herd instinct and the law of the herd which is authoritarian and conformist.
That authoritarian pressure is the enemy of free thought and the quest for knowledge. The pain of becoming an outsider comes with the territory. It is a badge of honor and courage.
You will have opportunities to find new friends and partners that affirm your changes.
I'm glad you found the CoR and this forum. You sound like someone with a lot to contribute.
Richard
Poor Richard
My Blog: Poor Richard's Almanack 2010
There is no answer. There is no solution. There is only practice. (Anon.)
My Blog: Poor Richard's Almanack 2010
There is no answer. There is no solution. There is only practice. (Anon.)
#10
Nortlov
- Group: Members
- Posts: 1
- Joined: 24-January 10
Posted 24 January 2010 - 10:24 PM
Hi,
So I've been observing the world and questioning change for a few years, and I asked myself today "why don't people want to change?", but I wanted to ask Google and stumbled upon this thread. I agree with what most people have said, and would like to add. People do not want change, even if they say it, no one wants change. If they did, they would go out and do what they needed to in order to acquire the change they want. People like feeling safe, they don't want to worry about who's going to get them, or what they're going to lose, or what they have to do about it, they would like to stay cozy in safety. Change is a leap into the darkness without a light, and most everyone is afraid of the darkness. But, what people don't realize is that once you're in the darkness, your eyes adjust and you begin with small steps making mistakes at first, and as you continue see better and better making fewer mistakes and actually causing change in others purely by observation. I agree with Quist about programming, though if there was a school system set-up properly, there would be the possibility of creating completely unbiased human beings that would have the fullest capability of love and compassion with the mental capacities of geniuses. A lot of people argue that people are born "bad" or "good", and that it is somehow your fault so you are ridiculed. People are absent from either a parents attention, some activity they would like to participate, or person they would like to interact with. When this happens they become sad and the brain takes over and starts basic (animalistic) instincts and the higher mind hibernates. This is what begins to make a "bad" person, such as a criminal or depressed/manic/etc., begin to act in ways we couldn't understand. Our brains have developed from animals and still have coding for survival needs, and this throws all thought process out the window. As an example, on a Discovery Channel program there was a single person who survived a plane crash into the ocean and was on a raft. There were rations, but they didn't last and he was still lost. He began fishing, eating the meat of the fish, but because of the type of fish he wasn't getting the nutrients he needed to live and started to deteriorate. His brain took over, because it knows what life requires and is willing to do anything to get it. The nutrients he needed were technically in the fish, but in the parts most would deem "disgusting" and in-edible. So he began to eat the eyes, liver, etc to get the freshwater and nutrients, but also started to enjoy and crave these parts he once thought gross. In contrast, shows like Survivorman and Man vs. Wild deliberately go into such situations and are able to do these things and cause their own survival because they have learned how to keep their mind in extreme situations and treat it like any other task. The mind is a powerful thing, and we must control it or it will ruin our lives.
But what Crimsonsun said is correct. If left to ourselves, one would never know the possibility of change. We must be stirred by some external event even though this might not be enough, because it takes an inquisitive nature and the proper idea of what we want. I would like to use myself as an example for this one. I am currently 25, and about the age of roughly 18 I knew I wanted to change. I badly wanted it. I was freshly in college and watched as other's social lives flourished whereas mine only slightly increased. I knew I wanted to be "cooler" and have friends and girls attention but had no idea what I wanted to be or how to get it. Change didn't really start for me till about the age of 20. I met an incredible girl who was smart and funny, but also quite gorgeous. As soon as I saw her I knew she was for me, but I didn't know how to ask her out or start it. Then I nearly ruined it at a party because I was too timid to say no to friends and got handcuffed to a different girl. Luckily a few months later I got the opportunity to start again with the first girl. I asked her out because I knew I wasn't going to mess up this time. We started off as exclusive with no titles, and things were going good and we were having fun. Six months in she said I wasn't giving her everything she needed, mostly conversation and some bad habits I had and that is really where the change began because like I said, there was no way I was going to mess up this time. But then a year into the relationship she told me there were things she needed to find for herself, and didn't know when we could be together again. This created a "blackhole" in my mind. My mind saw this unknown time of not being with the one I loved as forever and it broke me. My brain took over. I began having angry thoughts, that I wanted to cause the pain I felt emotionally as physical pain on others. People I knew, people on the street or at my job. Life felt quite unbearable, and the anger grew each day. But then one day, out of the blue, I had the thought "if I keep going like this, Im gonna end up hurting someone, I have to stop this and change or it will never get better". I started to write my thoughts down, to start to figure out a way to make me better. Leading to questioning why things were, and how they could be. A friend mentioned Buddhism, and I looked it up. The beliefs were a lot of the thoughts I had been writing down, and so much more. All this has led to my firm belief that the greatest tool a person can have is the skill of observation. If one can observe and try to understand, then try to make better, you will truly succeed in all you do. A lot of Albert Einstein's discoveries were based purely on observation and thought and were later proved. But the point of all this is that we each have to start somewhere, and change has started in the world, mostly made possible through the use of the internet. We have to figure out how to non-violently "shock" the world into seeing that change is possible. Even if some say it might be too late, we still have to try.
Christopher
So I've been observing the world and questioning change for a few years, and I asked myself today "why don't people want to change?", but I wanted to ask Google and stumbled upon this thread. I agree with what most people have said, and would like to add. People do not want change, even if they say it, no one wants change. If they did, they would go out and do what they needed to in order to acquire the change they want. People like feeling safe, they don't want to worry about who's going to get them, or what they're going to lose, or what they have to do about it, they would like to stay cozy in safety. Change is a leap into the darkness without a light, and most everyone is afraid of the darkness. But, what people don't realize is that once you're in the darkness, your eyes adjust and you begin with small steps making mistakes at first, and as you continue see better and better making fewer mistakes and actually causing change in others purely by observation. I agree with Quist about programming, though if there was a school system set-up properly, there would be the possibility of creating completely unbiased human beings that would have the fullest capability of love and compassion with the mental capacities of geniuses. A lot of people argue that people are born "bad" or "good", and that it is somehow your fault so you are ridiculed. People are absent from either a parents attention, some activity they would like to participate, or person they would like to interact with. When this happens they become sad and the brain takes over and starts basic (animalistic) instincts and the higher mind hibernates. This is what begins to make a "bad" person, such as a criminal or depressed/manic/etc., begin to act in ways we couldn't understand. Our brains have developed from animals and still have coding for survival needs, and this throws all thought process out the window. As an example, on a Discovery Channel program there was a single person who survived a plane crash into the ocean and was on a raft. There were rations, but they didn't last and he was still lost. He began fishing, eating the meat of the fish, but because of the type of fish he wasn't getting the nutrients he needed to live and started to deteriorate. His brain took over, because it knows what life requires and is willing to do anything to get it. The nutrients he needed were technically in the fish, but in the parts most would deem "disgusting" and in-edible. So he began to eat the eyes, liver, etc to get the freshwater and nutrients, but also started to enjoy and crave these parts he once thought gross. In contrast, shows like Survivorman and Man vs. Wild deliberately go into such situations and are able to do these things and cause their own survival because they have learned how to keep their mind in extreme situations and treat it like any other task. The mind is a powerful thing, and we must control it or it will ruin our lives.
But what Crimsonsun said is correct. If left to ourselves, one would never know the possibility of change. We must be stirred by some external event even though this might not be enough, because it takes an inquisitive nature and the proper idea of what we want. I would like to use myself as an example for this one. I am currently 25, and about the age of roughly 18 I knew I wanted to change. I badly wanted it. I was freshly in college and watched as other's social lives flourished whereas mine only slightly increased. I knew I wanted to be "cooler" and have friends and girls attention but had no idea what I wanted to be or how to get it. Change didn't really start for me till about the age of 20. I met an incredible girl who was smart and funny, but also quite gorgeous. As soon as I saw her I knew she was for me, but I didn't know how to ask her out or start it. Then I nearly ruined it at a party because I was too timid to say no to friends and got handcuffed to a different girl. Luckily a few months later I got the opportunity to start again with the first girl. I asked her out because I knew I wasn't going to mess up this time. We started off as exclusive with no titles, and things were going good and we were having fun. Six months in she said I wasn't giving her everything she needed, mostly conversation and some bad habits I had and that is really where the change began because like I said, there was no way I was going to mess up this time. But then a year into the relationship she told me there were things she needed to find for herself, and didn't know when we could be together again. This created a "blackhole" in my mind. My mind saw this unknown time of not being with the one I loved as forever and it broke me. My brain took over. I began having angry thoughts, that I wanted to cause the pain I felt emotionally as physical pain on others. People I knew, people on the street or at my job. Life felt quite unbearable, and the anger grew each day. But then one day, out of the blue, I had the thought "if I keep going like this, Im gonna end up hurting someone, I have to stop this and change or it will never get better". I started to write my thoughts down, to start to figure out a way to make me better. Leading to questioning why things were, and how they could be. A friend mentioned Buddhism, and I looked it up. The beliefs were a lot of the thoughts I had been writing down, and so much more. All this has led to my firm belief that the greatest tool a person can have is the skill of observation. If one can observe and try to understand, then try to make better, you will truly succeed in all you do. A lot of Albert Einstein's discoveries were based purely on observation and thought and were later proved. But the point of all this is that we each have to start somewhere, and change has started in the world, mostly made possible through the use of the internet. We have to figure out how to non-violently "shock" the world into seeing that change is possible. Even if some say it might be too late, we still have to try.
Christopher
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